Sexual Drift

[00:00] Let's do it yeah, we don't we don't really do a thing right we just do a thing
[00:05] Yeah, there's no opening. It's just cold open
[00:09] All right team, which is how I like my ladies
[00:11] I
[00:21] Swear I'm his dad
[00:27] We do under Google rules that was the play of super excited told us we had to
[00:47] We signed up for it in the end it's gonna be better and more true than Google can give you
[00:55] All right team it is time for another under Google
[01:01] I'm just sitting here ready
[01:04] To impart some knowledge on the world, but I don't know the topic get Coalson. What do you got for me?
[01:12] So oftentimes on the show will will do evolutionary questions like you know
[01:19] Why are dogs why are dogs noses wet you know things like that why do bunnies have cotton tails
[01:26] things like that
[01:29] Well, you know
[01:32] And and I am and I feel like I learned a lot
[01:35] I feel like I feel like one of the things about the under Googles is it's helped me understand evolution
[01:41] Talking to my three favorite friends
[01:44] Smartest friends as well. Not also not only favorite but smartest
[01:48] and so
[01:50] We've learned a little bit about
[01:53] How dogs don't have sweat glands right and they just pant mm-hmm
[02:00] So I started thinking about human sweat glands and why that's useful and
[02:05] then I started thinking about how
[02:07] All the places I majorly sweat I have hair and so then I started thinking why aren't
[02:16] humans furry
[02:18] Right, like like most mammals have a really good like they have a temperature control system, right?
[02:24] Like that's the thing about mammals. That's what's kept them alive over ice ages and heat waves and things and
[02:32] And all of them have fur
[02:35] Except us and I want to know why that's
[02:40] Useful why humans don't have why humans aren't furry. That's my question
[02:45] The we changed we came from apes and their furry
[02:49] But we're not I think I think some humans do identify as furries
[02:58] Yeah, did we decide that fuzzies was the thing too, I don't know you
[03:06] Fuzzies was something you made up and it was never real. It's probably a thing
[03:11] Right probably after our show. Yeah. Yeah, so so does that make
[03:18] Question makes sense. Is it I'm not I'm not being an idiot here. No, no, it's a very good question
[03:26] I would quibble with the all mammals have fur part of that equation because there are many
[03:32] mammals that don't
[03:34] elephants don't whales
[03:36] Whales dolphins. Yeah, poor pieces
[03:40] Point this or beside. Okay
[03:43] But I mean elephants have hair hogs don't have a ton pigs don't have a lot of hair. Yeah, you're right
[03:48] I mean, but like they're not in furry. We also have hair, right? Like right
[03:52] So do we need a difference between hairy and furry?
[03:57] Cuz yeah, I mean, I think I think what I'm talking about is like when you're completely covered with with hair
[04:03] So I you know, I've met some people that are on something, right?
[04:07] But like, you know, my my hair is in my armpits and in my you know
[04:11] And my crotch and on my head and my beard right like yeah
[04:19] But there it's not on the tops of my feet or you know, I mean, I'm fairly hairless
[04:24] I don't have a big old, you know chess carpet. Some folks do that's fine. I'm not judging you Joey. I'm just
[04:34] This is an audio podcast
[04:37] This week we're putting out the video
[04:41] I'm just saying how does that help me?
[04:44] Does I'm just wondering if the lack of hair or fur helps me?
[04:49] Evolutionarily me specifically helps me evolutionarily over a chimpanzee or whether it's just I mean because it's got to happen for a reason
[04:57] Right. Why why are humans not furry? I guess is my question. I mean
[05:06] I'm not a not a scientist, but I I I dabble and
[05:12] I mean I
[05:13] And I feel like I mean the obvious
[05:16] Thing for me to start with is is temperature control, you know, just not have not having that cuz you don't need it
[05:23] You know when you're you know, the more hair you have I feel like, you know, it's gonna trap trap more heat in
[05:30] But and you know for the most part
[05:36] I mean for a lot of part, you know, the
[05:40] humans live in in places that you
[05:42] You know for much of the year you don't need too much covering
[05:47] No, I mean I agree with that but like but like a monkey lives in like the tropics or whatever and like
[05:53] Isn't isn't there in their fur like if you sweat in your fur it kind of cools you off
[05:59] Right catches the breeze and all that stuff. But also when it's cold, you've got more insulation like at night or whatever
[06:04] I I just figured that was the whole thing like the sweat the sweating on your hair cools you off in
[06:11] a way that
[06:12] You know your hair gets wet
[06:14] This on your skin
[06:17] I think is gonna be more effective at cooling you off cuz that on your hair
[06:21] The air has more access to it and it evaporates directly on the skin and that will cool the blood that is going by
[06:27] the skin
[06:29] That's why that's why we sweat the and the
[06:33] Not needing it. I sort of disagree with Joey because I think we
[06:38] evolved or humans
[06:41] diverged I guess from
[06:43] Whatever homo habilis or something like that during the ice age basically
[06:47] So it would not have been in that like it would have been more advantageous to have more hair to stay warm
[06:54] I think great
[06:56] Although hair makes you warmer. I
[06:59] guess the divergence happened in the
[07:02] Great Rift Valley. Yeah, exactly. So like Central Africa, right? So
[07:08] So maybe that does make sense I guess but
[07:13] I've got a couple things I
[07:16] The first and biggest one is just that brains
[07:19] Take up like a massive amount of energy and create a ton of heat way more than any of our
[07:28] you know relative
[07:30] Way more than chips, right?
[07:32] So like the cost of having a really big brain is a ton of heat regulation
[07:39] So that may have been part of a trade-off at some point
[07:43] I'm just too hot to have fur because I'm smart that that could be something. I also suspect that
[07:51] You know at least in in the the last few thousand years
[07:56] Probably maybe some sexual drift involved
[07:59] Which is humans are now outside of evolution on some level like we don't have predators. So the things that are
[08:07] You know
[08:09] the most appealing
[08:12] Did you skip written in the genetic code? That's why we have seven foot two two kilo neils
[08:16] Like that's there's no evolutionary reason for that
[08:20] What was just that tall people have sex with each other?
[08:23] Okay, also you were in the band sexual drift, right?
[08:32] That was my that was my biggest band honestly, that was the closest we ever got to success
[08:37] I think it was all about the name honestly because we were bad. We were not good
[08:44] Well, okay you on triangle in that band
[08:47] I
[08:49] Thought that might have been a pinnacle of your I've been through so many bands on triangle
[08:53] Like at that point I would actually gotten pretty good. You did just have more cowbell you would have made
[08:59] So, okay, so here's the here's the one of things I think about I know that
[09:06] Because we did the lawn
[09:09] episode and
[09:10] That we talked about in that episode. We talked about the reason people have
[09:15] Well, that doesn't matter we touched on the fact that the planes is is how
[09:23] sort of people evolved by
[09:26] Going out of the forests, right? And so so you need to have
[09:31] Long field of vision you need to have flat feet you need to have you need to be able to
[09:36] Chase something for a long period of time. So like, you know a buffalo can or not a buffalo
[09:42] You know a zebra can run really fast
[09:44] But it gets tired if you can just kind of keep going after it, right? You'll eventually catch it, right?
[09:50] So these are these are the things that kind of help us evolutionarily. I just don't
[09:55] Nice break down from Coalson over here
[09:58] I've listened to enough of these shows, but what I don't understand is why not having hair is useful
[10:06] because everybody else has hair outside of whales and dolphins and
[10:10] Elephants and whatever. I get that. Why isn't everything elephants is probably the answer
[10:16] Everything should be elephants
[10:20] But I just don't understand how why why we went from Neanderthals or monkeys and that we were super hairy
[10:26] And then we're not and how that helped us become what we are today. It doesn't make any sense to me
[10:31] Like I understand we're not we're not all the real question is why are monkeys so hairy? It's hot out there, man
[10:38] Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. And like I don't have a real good answer to that
[10:42] because
[10:43] Sure, like after the Great Rift Valley like we separated and then you know
[10:48] There's a couple different theories about this but like whatever we spread out throughout the world things got cold and then humans and Neanderthals
[10:55] branched, you know, whatever
[10:58] 20,000 years ago that the Neanderthals die or whatever it is
[11:02] And we were a little bit less hairy with actually slightly smaller brains
[11:07] But more well organized brains
[11:10] Because the organization it actually turns out is a little bit more important than the size per se
[11:17] Let's do it with someone with a small brain would say
[11:23] It's just it's super well organized
[11:26] Yeah, and then you come into my house once you're like, oh my god
[11:31] Why is everything on the floor what is happening?
[11:33] But no as as we moved back down to southern climbs
[11:39] It would make sense that that we would you know lose some of that hair that certainly makes sense, right?
[11:45] But if you're talking about an ice age and we're moving north and we're moving into Europe and all that stuff
[11:49] It's getting colder. Like it doesn't make any sense to lose hair
[11:52] Well, but I mean one of the branches that was happening at that like during that ice age
[11:56] Was that branch between Neanderthals and you know modern?
[12:02] homo homo
[12:04] Right, okay, I wonder if the advent of clothing has anything to do with this or the
[12:11] Sure, so I killed a deer and put it on me
[12:14] so not only put from the perspective of you less have fewer demands on
[12:20] Staying warm because you're using alternative methods, but also like
[12:24] maybe there's like a physical I don't know like just it keeps the hair shorter or something like that like constantly and then I
[12:32] Don't know then you just slowly don't need it
[12:34] I don't know that that actually probably is just the straight-up answer right once you have clothing you don't need for you don't need hair, right?
[12:42] Because I'm not having hair presumably is advantageous from a cooling perspective, right?
[12:49] There's only access to clothing you can stay warm
[12:53] Basically, and but also and fight but also cool yourself, right? Yeah
[12:58] But then you can cool yourself by stripping all those things off now
[13:01] So okay, so then why do we have hair in the hot places?
[13:05] Right, right because you don't need but the monkeys still have hair in hot places
[13:09] Why don't why don't what you know, why have they not evolved out of that?
[13:13] Well, yeah, but they can't but they can't make a campfire and sit around and sing songs
[13:17] Yeah, yeah, and they're really bad at clothing. Have you ever seen a monkey stitch?
[13:20] I
[13:22] They look great on roller skates though. Yeah, that's a fact and in two twos incidentally, but you know, they can't sew the tooth
[13:30] I mean, I think that the hair in
[13:34] Hot places or whatever right? So like the so the hair on the head I guess is confusing but the
[13:40] Everything else so like the pubic keeps the top of your head from burning, right?
[13:45] I mean, that's the other thing right if we're in a hot space. We're getting burned all the time now granted
[13:50] The melatonin is changed as we've left the hotter areas, right? Yeah
[13:56] but the other the other forms of hair that you develop after you go through puberty are
[14:03] Related to sexual wellness, I think right so especially in men like testosterone
[14:08] and I think in females estrogen and whatnot drive those things so
[14:13] the there's a direct tie to
[14:17] a
[14:19] Sort of a sexual selection and that so sexual
[14:27] So is it is it a pheromone thing right like are we able to share our smells more with the with the hair
[14:35] That I don't know that's a good question. I mean definitely hair is smelly
[14:40] Right for sure. That's definitely a thing
[14:44] So the hair on the head and the hair and like, you know the pits in the junk
[14:47] Those are like two different things. So the head thing
[14:51] probably
[14:54] Whatever your brain is the most important part of your body
[14:56] It's the only thing that needs to survive right once that's done. Everything else is a wrap, right?
[15:02] So you can use the entire rest of your body to cool, right?
[15:07] But you got to make sure that your brain stays warm in a pinch maybe
[15:12] Okay sure
[15:14] Alright, and then yeah the other thing I mean, yeah fear amounts, right? I mean
[15:20] Such as they don't exist right? I mean, you know smelly
[15:24] Yeah, no, I mean, I mean I you can people are attracted to certain stinks. It's
[15:32] Yeah, it is a thing I mean and Joey, you know what Joey's thinking right now he's always loved my stank
[15:42] You know, I
[15:46] so I've
[15:47] Been doing I've been doing a little research. I've been looking. Oh, okay. We look it up about constant stank
[15:54] No, that is
[15:56] No, he doesn't have to look it up. He remembers it and his nose and in his heart
[16:03] I'm gonna leave that one on salt. It's an unsolved mystery. I'll keep that way
[16:08] so what I'm seeing is that there's definitely not a
[16:14] An answer that has been like universally recognized from what I've seen
[16:19] there's a couple of
[16:21] pretty interesting and potentially, you know, or potentially multiples that are
[16:29] Contributing but one of them was like
[16:34] Just a method of controlling parasites. Oh sure
[16:40] That makes sense
[16:43] You know the fewer like
[16:46] License things, you know, lots of them stick on your hair and carry the Lyme disease and other killers. Yeah
[16:53] Another one that I've seen several times is the semi-aquatic
[16:57] It's like semi-aquatic theory
[17:02] And
[17:04] aquatic ape hypothesis
[17:06] But it sounds like there were some some groups or say like so hair is not generally
[17:12] Good for when you're swimming. Okay, so if if if you know
[17:18] ancestors of ours were
[17:20] You know in their culture swimming was was you know done a lot that might be a detriment to it
[17:27] You know, so that's super interesting
[17:29] But like part-time water life doesn't seem like it should like affect the evolutionary
[17:35] Like hair is not that distracting when you're swimming, right? Like there's no way
[17:43] It's interesting and another one. Well, I guess like what I was saying up earlier was that some of these are
[17:52] Like like you had said the and I'll say it again sexual drift
[17:56] Because I like that phrase and that's definitely the name of the pod
[18:00] But some of these are just you know
[18:03] It may have started with one of these sort of
[18:08] For one of these reasons and then and then it became something that was attractive, you know, and so it's not a or B
[18:16] It's a B C and D
[18:18] Yeah
[18:20] Oh boy, we're getting into some stuff here. This is this is like I think this is adjacent territory. So
[18:29] The hairless plantar region of mice
[18:32] Are found to have high levels of DK K to
[18:37] Suggesting the protein might keep bits of skin hairless by block blocking a signaling pathway called
[18:45] Wnt
[18:46] known to control hair growth
[18:50] Went beta-contending pathway. All right, cool. I
[18:54] Know you'd be excited about that. So apparently we have a lot of that in our body
[18:58] That's not a thing that you actually knew. Oh
[19:00] Yeah, oh, it's DK K. Of course, he did DK. He is dick off I think
[19:08] Seriously, no that I said it's in the article
[19:13] To
[19:17] Yes, so that basically they're saying this is why we're hairless but we
[19:22] That's the molecular mechanism, right, but we don't know why that happened
[19:27] So we know the molecular reason we know we know how it happens, right we just don't know why the why is
[19:35] I'm seeing thermal regulation
[19:38] Yeah
[19:39] Yeah, that's what I'm saying to use. We're just we're out in the Savannah out in the middle of the you know
[19:45] And and being overheated
[19:48] It's not good for your brain function. No. Okay, so go back to Harper's Theory about protecting the brain. Oh my gosh
[19:56] Humans are the sweatiest primates of life. We have five up to five million sweat glands
[20:01] They produce a maximum of about 12 liters of the stuff per day
[20:08] I think Joey and I we're really driving up the average I
[20:12] was I was at a
[20:14] Cookout today and just standing there and probably dropped a liter or two
[20:25] 12 liters of water a day. So I'm pretty sure I'm under that. Yeah
[20:30] There's a type of monkey called the pattest monkey, which is very fast running and they also have a lot of sweat glands and
[20:37] sweat a lot and
[20:40] Probably to stay cool
[20:42] Yeah, and this Smithsonian article there's
[20:45] so the time when when
[20:48] Humans were on the Savannah
[20:51] Yeah, that thermoregulation part saying losing all the fur it helps you
[20:56] Sweat during the day and then at night you've got clothes and you know fire so you you're okay without that hair
[21:04] Because we you know augmented with technology
[21:08] Well, and and you guys mentioned this before. I mean you said that we have the most sweat glands
[21:13] You know on earth
[21:15] apparently
[21:17] Sweating is more efficient if you're hairless as you mentioned very early in our theory. So
[21:22] There's some sort of combination between us losing hair and gaining sweat glands or vice versa that they sort of things work together
[21:30] To get us to cool off in the heat. It was very important for us to dump heat
[21:36] while we chased
[21:38] animals in the Savannah
[21:40] So there you go. You were right on it. What one additional hypothesis the naked love hypothesis
[21:48] It's not gonna be as much fun as you think it actually suggests that human hairlessness increase a mother's love for her child
[21:55] Which sees backwards to me because I like dogs more than people but right for sure
[22:00] Hey, I'd like a little fuzzy animal to take care of right?
[22:06] Yeah, I wonder that I mean so I'm thinking of
[22:11] non altricial
[22:14] Species like mice or something that are born. Yeah, you just used a word. We don't know
[22:20] so
[22:22] Yeah
[22:24] like like
[22:25] Like horses right are born and they're able to basically do walk in right out
[22:29] Yeah, they can run like right away and then and humans are dumber and shit, right?
[22:34] I sort of like naked pink things that you can't do anything right that don't even have their eyes open or their ears
[22:40] I've been or anything like that. Yeah, altricial are born in an undeveloped state requiring care and feeding by the parents. So
[22:47] Oh, is it all your wishes like altruism? No, no a l t r i c i a l
[22:55] You wonder if it's the same route though. Yeah, I don't
[23:02] Cuz yeah the like yeah those mice are completely helpless right like
[23:12] Yeah
[23:13] Human if you can't like you basically have to like scoop them up to the teat or they're just gonna die, right?
[23:18] They can't figure it out. Right? Which base question. Why does anyone ever scoop them up to anyone's teeth cuz they're mice and they're gross
[23:26] Do you think the mother mouse looks at the baby mice and was like you're gross you're a mouse
[23:31] Yeah, see this is the thing
[23:33] If our theory says that hairless things are more attractive then that's definitely not true in the mouse world
[23:40] Do you are we working with the theory that that all mice look at the other mice of their own species and think they're gross
[23:49] But what I was what what I was saying was like, yeah, maybe the hairlessness triggers some old ancient thing from when
[23:59] Yeah, I guess I'll trish old species right if we came from that line
[24:03] I don't know what the evolutionary tree looks like. Oh, I see what you came from that line, right like a more naked
[24:10] Baby would be right and we like holy crap. I really need to take care of this thing cuz it is
[24:18] Blind and deaf and dumb basically and and that's actually a part of this theory
[24:23] That's baked into this as well
[24:24] Right because if the parent is extra hairy the kid with like, you know
[24:28] Prehensile everything can just grab onto that fur and ride mom and in that way they're protected
[24:34] Whereas if they if the parents don't have that
[24:37] And the kids don't have that then they actually have to be actively watching
[24:42] Set off care for them. Yeah, and babies are you have very well designed to
[24:48] To trigger us to take care of they really are
[24:51] This is why babies and puppies are cute. So you don't strangle them. Exactly
[24:55] Yeah, it's the only reason that that it doesn't happen and the reason you don't just like leave them behind like, right?
[25:02] Could you stop crying? I'm just gonna leave now. I
[25:04] Mean that's right. That's how a chimp does it but the chimp baby is like I ain't going nowhere
[25:13] I'm gonna keep crying on your back too. Yeah, that's too fat wrapped around your neck word together, right?
[25:20] You're really
[25:21] Killing my vibe though right now with the crying trying to listen to some music trying to have a nice night out
[25:28] You just cry in all the time. I'm just gonna leave you under this bush and it'll be fine
[25:34] Oh, but you're kind of cute
[25:37] Guess I'll hold on to you
[25:41] Joey are you looking forward to this? Yeah, I am. I am looking forward to this
[25:45] You'll be part of that. Actually, I'm not sure you're gonna be part of the hairless line, but
[25:52] True I'm gonna have a baby hanging off my beard probably
[25:56] If it's a smart yeah, it's probably gonna be smart enough to yeah, it's called super smart. Oh, yeah
[26:04] Oh, yeah, I'll just be it. Just be clung to your chest hair the entire time the moment comes out of the womb
[26:11] I'm excited about the the the new the new show we're gonna be having here pretty soon on under Google's jr
[26:19] So where we have all the kids do the under Google yeah, we'll ask them the same questions and see what they come up
[26:28] I I like this very much
[26:30] Yeah, I think this is a great idea. We're suddenly like Lebron James
[26:33] We've got to do this long enough that we can have our kids play with us
[26:36] I think we should all be the you know, I want to be in the first, you know batch of billionaire podcasters
[26:42] That's all I'm asking
[26:49] All right, well, I think we regardless we were pretty close to nailing it so good work team
[26:55] Yeah, yeah, actually it turns out if you put the four of us in a room we can come up with why we're not furry
[27:00] Yeah, yeah
[27:04] That should be our tagline
[27:07] That's the next
[27:11] It's gonna be like a bigger
[27:13] That's for your maybe a t-shirt or for I think you could do a 40 ounce kuzi 40