Carry an Extra Lid

[00:03] You get that back up beer opened up for the second sink. Oh, we should have done second sink is crack a beer
[00:12] That's old-school days that's how we used to yeah
[00:15] Back in my day. We didn't have these fancy-dancey sinks. We just don't bear so we liked it
[00:34] Under Google rules that was the play of super excited told us we had to
[00:39] I said we signed up for it in the end. It's gonna be better and more true than Google can give you
[00:49] Alright gentlemen. Well, we're in the midst of the summer. It's August. There's nothing going on in the basketball world. So let's
[00:58] Let's solve some problems
[00:59] Coalson is there anything we can?
[01:01] Answer for you. What's on your mind? I've got a ton of problems, but
[01:07] None of them you can solve I do have questions, however
[01:13] in the the
[01:15] long run running segment we call the under Google Bulls I come to
[01:20] you know, some of my smartest friends and and
[01:24] Help them help me work through some stuff. And here's a phrase that I've been worried about lately
[01:32] Open a can of worms
[01:36] Hmm. What do you what do you I feel like do you keep worms and cans?
[01:45] Worms I what happens I feel like the opening a can of worms is a bad thing
[01:51] Yeah, that's definitely you don't want to get into the subject area because you don't want to open that can of worms cuz that's bad
[01:58] Right, but like this once you're in it, you're in it, right? Yeah
[02:02] Yeah, and and I feel like you know, you could say don't open that can of
[02:09] Roaches, you know something that got in a can but worms don't get in cans do they
[02:14] Don't think so. I mean, I used to go fishing with my dad and we we would get worms
[02:18] But they would be like in a styrofoam container with a lid that you could easily
[02:22] I mean, I worms would die if you put them in a can I would think but do the worms actually need to be alive
[02:30] I mean there was a well-preserved one would think in the can and
[02:35] You know before the days when we had such a robust
[02:39] Worm breeding culture
[02:41] We could just get everyone all the worms that they needed, you know, maybe we have these dick can of and ship
[02:47] sure, but what are the the imagery of the phrase the
[02:52] Complexity of the thing that you're opening up to me the image of worms wiggling around makes it even more complicated
[03:00] To track, you know a single thread of an idea or whatever
[03:04] But oh I see so would you expound on that like
[03:07] So opening a can of worms is about making things more complex not just worse
[03:14] That's the way I have always taken it. Okay is that interesting
[03:18] Yeah, we don't even want to get into that area because it's just gonna take too long to explain or like sort out
[03:24] But yeah, I think it has a negative con connotation in that respect, but I don't think it's in and of itself
[03:29] bad, right
[03:31] Okay, so it's just not really complex. Yeah, I
[03:36] Mean it certainly can be like yes, it can be but it doesn't necessarily need to be it can just be something that you know
[03:44] The territory that you're not willing or prepared to walk into right because yeah, it'll take it'll take too long to resolve or
[03:52] Yeah, I agree. Yeah, I always thought of it as negative like this is just this is this is a bad area
[03:57] And I and the way I interpreted it, you know, you you know, Jason you said you open the can of worms and all the worms
[04:03] are wriggling I always thought of it as
[04:06] canned food I'd opened and there were worms in it and so they had sort of
[04:12] Maggetty. Yeah, but yeah, but it's not maggots which so it doesn't really make sense because worms aren't like maggots
[04:18] right, but I just kind of always
[04:21] felt like it was about bugs infesting my
[04:25] My sustenance so I always thought of it as negative but I think that's probably that would definitely be negative
[04:32] And always be a bad
[04:35] Might my experience with worms goes back to fishing with my grandmother. They didn't seem that hard to catch
[04:44] I don't know. I suppose you could fill a can with them
[04:50] You know
[04:51] Are you technically pray still can't just bet anything that you want
[04:57] Might this have to do with the the practical joke of the can of worms where you
[05:06] Blows up in your face. No, I didn't even think about that
[05:09] That's fine. Is that called is that considered a worm? I thought it was a snake
[05:14] Is it a can of snakes? Is it a I don't know what that thought you open it up and it was like snakes. I
[05:21] Mean snakes are worm like
[05:26] Tubes in within tubes, right?
[05:30] So you're saying this is the joke can
[05:32] You open it up. They but worms blow up in your face. Do you want some some?
[05:38] You know peanuts or whatever
[05:41] It's not peanuts. It's things springing out and scaring the bejesus out of you
[05:45] But does that but that doesn't add to the complexity that you're talking about right? Which is can of worms makes everything more
[05:53] True difficult. That's just a you know, I mean, you know, depending on how bad you get scared
[05:58] Maybe now you got to do laundry, you know, it's not a heart attack
[06:01] I mean, there's there's added complexity to be had sure enough. Fair enough
[06:06] When do we think this phrase came about? Do you guys have a guess? Ah, when did they come up with worms? I
[06:15] Think around that I think that I think that was on the sixth day
[06:25] Worms so you can cut a worm in half and they can regrow themselves. They're like very basic
[06:32] Yes, they're very very basic and and does that mean they're earlier on the
[06:38] Evolutionary chain than humans. I
[06:42] I don't know for sure but I would guess yes earthworms have been around
[06:48] Many millennia before
[06:51] Okay. Ooh, ooh now that you said earthworms. What about mealworms? That's a thing
[06:58] That is a thing. Yeah, like
[07:00] Mealworms are in flower. I think they live in flower. Ooh
[07:06] This is what it is
[07:08] You don't want to open up a can of your flower with mealworms in it
[07:14] Okay, again that I think it all depends on
[07:17] What the connotation is supposed to be if it's supposed to be bad all the time then I think your answer is right
[07:23] It's supposed to be it's just more complicated then
[07:27] Maybe it's still but you could you can sift it out
[07:32] You can sift out the mealworms mealworms a day you wouldn't like just throw out. No, you would not throw at the fire
[07:37] You know just sifted out
[07:40] So can't when do we start canning things?
[07:42] So that makes me feel like it's very friend tears II, right?
[07:48] So we were big into canning. I'm sure we've been canning on some level or other since
[07:53] I
[07:54] Mean ten shortly after metallurgy. Yeah
[07:59] Okay
[08:00] Sure, that's a long time
[08:02] Yeah, it is a long time, but I think back that far. I feel like cans are gonna be with mass production, right?
[08:11] I mean you can
[08:14] Well, so I don't know
[08:17] Certainly that is I mean we mass produce them. Certainly, but I don't know
[08:21] That was our first introduction into the world was we invented it and mass produced it, right?
[08:27] Right. No, no, I'm with you on that that we had cans before mass production
[08:30] I was just trying to figure out if it would become if enough people had cans
[08:34] to be a part of the
[08:35] And so so I guess I need some clarification here because originally I was things about cans in like a tin can or an aluminum
[08:43] can or something like that that you would need a can opener to open but
[08:47] when you make
[08:48] Like jelly or something like that and then you put you put it in the glass jar and then you seal the thing
[08:53] That's a that's the canning process. Okay, we call it. Yeah. Yeah. Okay, so that's a different thing
[08:59] And so yeah, pretty much anything that you can airtight seal you've affected the can, right?
[09:08] But I agree with you this does seem frontiersy to me so like mid
[09:13] 1800s yeah, maybe
[09:16] Yeah
[09:18] Maybe 1700s. I have no idea. No, I'm gonna I'm gonna go with pre-civil war
[09:25] Like let's go with like 1830s 1840s
[09:30] And that's when you think the phrase originated was around then yeah, I think you've got a bunch of
[09:36] cans
[09:37] and flour
[09:40] filled with millworms
[09:42] Okay, and we think this is an American thing
[09:44] Yeah, that's what I'm going with feels like fishing down at the crick feels like a very American. You know what I mean?
[09:51] So for my money
[09:53] Yeah, if it's actual like earthworms, we're thinking frontiers America
[09:58] All right. Let's see what we got
[10:01] So according to
[10:04] Miriam Webster
[10:06] Is to create a complicated situation?
[10:10] In which doing something to correct a problem leads to many more problems
[10:16] As in our boss wanted is reluctant to change the policy now because she doesn't want to open a can of worms
[10:24] That's a good better definition. That is that is better is is
[10:31] Okay, can't canning wasn't invented until 1809
[10:36] feels like
[10:38] And another thing that we missed is apparently that it is an attempt to solve a problem only to inadvertently complicate it
[10:45] That's not my understanding of it. Yeah
[10:49] That's
[10:50] Yeah, that feels like more of like the jellyfish thing, right?
[10:53] Maybe this is that maybe it's the same thing with the worms, right? You cut it in half and you end up with two
[10:58] You're just multiplying your problems
[11:00] Okay, so this
[11:02] Today, I found it suggests that in the 1950s fishermen used to buy sealed metal cans of earthworms
[11:11] And what was left inside?
[11:13] Was alive and the top was left open or tipped over
[11:18] The problem would become catching your bait instead of catching fish. I
[11:23] Don't know how I feel about that but I
[11:26] Mean that definitely like makes sense to me in a literal sense, right? Like yeah, you know, yeah
[11:32] The thing that you had sought for a solution becomes in and of itself the problem. Yeah, okay
[11:37] Actually, that's pretty direct and it says that they've got the first documented phrase
[11:43] In Edwardsville, intelligent, Illinois in 1951
[11:48] I don't know if you've got anything before that
[11:52] Yeah, no, I'm looking at mental floss and they say similarly that
[11:57] Phrase is born in the US in the early 1950 or 1950s or earlier
[12:04] the in 1951
[12:06] This usage was used though the question of command for Middle East defense against sovereign or sorry Soviet aggression
[12:12] It's still regarded as a quote can of worms a general Eisenhower's shape headquarters here
[12:17] so, I mean you have to be pretty well entrenched and
[12:21] In the spoken language to end up in like military jargon. Yeah, you know what I mean?
[12:27] And and yeah
[12:29] showing up in the paper
[12:31] And that was recording
[12:33] 51 that was 51
[12:35] Okay, so it's probably
[12:37] in wide use before that
[12:40] This suggests that it's essentially just an Americanized version of opening Pandora's box. I
[12:46] Was American and we nailed that. Yep. Yep. Yeah, well, actually, I mean
[12:55] When would when did canning start?
[12:58] 1809 1809. Yeah, I think we're probably there. I mean just because it didn't come in the parlance till later
[13:03] This is yeah, they said that
[13:06] That that used to buy bait and cans
[13:10] And that if your bait got loose you had a bigger problem than than fishing
[13:16] Okay
[13:18] Just carry a extra lid. That's what I say